Hi. Maybe there has been a similar topic before but I didn't see it.
Only to know the different opinions about an specialised big traditional waveboard (118l or bigger), compared to a sup board which can be used for catching waves also with a sail.
In my case I went to the second option. I have a fanatic stubby 8'2" 105 litres which I use both for supping and for supsailing in the waves. I must admit it's a bit difficult for me to surf without footstraps, but it's wider than a 118 litres so no balance problem in very light winds and you use one board for two purposes. Compared to one colleague big board, I think the sup goes in through the sets easier, but the surfing is a bit less maneubrable due to the larger width and length, I guess.
Thanks.
The problem with surf SUP is the sail is exactly in the wrong place for front foot placement - so people tend to do it for a while and give up.
A big waveboard is definitely the go.
SUP wave sailing can be huge fun - had many sessions where not a hope of me getting out on wave gear
I know someone who bought then immediately sold a Goya 118. He said it was so domed/corky that it was like a log and no easier to uphaul than the 110 Cube it was supposed to replace.
He frequently sails a Sea-lion on the light days at a decent level.
You might look at something a bit wider like the 115 Quantum which in my experience might not be as surfy but they are dead easy boards to sail.
As a little tyke, I's go surf SUP over dedicated big boy waverider.
No jumps in light wind.
Need to move feet in barely planing conditions.
Width makes feet placement always changing.
Nice cushy deck.
It's two different sensations. I love my Sealion, a lot of moving on the deck, definitly a + in my quiver!!!
I've got a friend who's a really good wave sailor, goes with a 104 Quattro in most conditions but goes to his SUP Sealion to sail when it gets really light. He has a blast! I used to love SUP sailing my Fanatic Foil Stubby (without the foil). The thing was fun and it enabled me to dramatically improve my wavesailing skills.
Then I got the Goya Custom 115 and realized I could uphaul it and after a while I realized it was really fun in float and ride conditions so I sold the Fanatic Foil Stubby as it just couldn't compete when on the wave face.
Either way you're in for a good time and the SUP wave sailing can really help your overall skills.
DC
Hello
Only to summarize some differences between large wave boards and sup sailing boards:
-I've heard many sup sailing boards have broken the mast insert in wave smashing. I guess the single mast insert is much weaker than the traditional mast rail, right?
-The traditional big wave boards get planning and upwind much better than the sup boards, better for on-shore conditions
- Surfing is better with TBWB than sup boards because of the reduced lenght and width
- Balance, stance and uphauling in very light conditions is better with sup boards as they are wider and have flatter deck
Do you know cases of SUP boards mast insert broken?
Thanks.
i would agree with the lac of strength of the mast insert in the SUPs.
My one got ripped out to easily . It was a one inch cube glassed into the board.
That was a JP. waves were quite small but got hit the right way
That was a sad day
It's pretty easy to find a windsup with a traditional mast track (Exocet/Sealion/RRD). In Punta San Carlos, they wouldn't let us put sails on the SUPs with threaded mast inserts. Luckily, they also had a bunch of windsups with regular mast tracks.
Does somebody know why I feel on going down the wave very slowly with supsurfing board compared with a regular waveboard? Would it be because of the increased width, the small size of the fins of the sup (5" trifin) for the sail, or the rocker?
The volume of the SUP is 105 litres, only a bit bigger than my light wind board.
Select to expand quoteMucel said..
Does somebody know why I feel on going down the wave very slowly with supsurfing board compared with a regular waveboard? Would it be because of the increased width, the small size of the fins of the sup (5" trifin) for the sail, or the rocker?
The volume of the SUP is 105 litres, only a bit bigger than my light wind board.
My guess is it's the rocker.
The SUP sticks to the waveface resp. needs the push of the wave to keep planing, whereas the flat rocker of a windsurfboard gives you more speed once planing.
Wave windsurf has lots of rocker.
Big gear feels slow.
Tiny gear in high wind feels quick.
You are not dialed in 4.5 and 75 liter conditions.
Do you know if a mix board among waveboard and sup surf has existed? This is, a wide board with mast track and footstraps, capable of planning and getting upwind with a very flat deck? Maybe you could use only the front strap for surfing and move your back foot to the leeward rail to make the wide tail turn tighter.
Probably way too big, but there's this:
www.exocet-original.com/windsup-pro-am-10-c2x33091967
Thanks. Exocet developed this concept making boards longer and keeping a reasonable width, but I think it's not good for carrying the boards inside van/car and manoeuvrability. IMO the kona 8'6" 120 litr was the best compromise.
The approach used by the sealion is making boards wider, which I think is better for the balance on shlogging and manoeuvrability. The problem it's a multipurpose sup board so the rocker and lack of footstraps are not so good for planning and getting upwind.
As far as I know no brand has made a board specialised only in very light wavesailing conditions: float and ride, no jumping or choppy conditions, planing slowly, shlog comfortably and good upwind performance to get to the peak.
Could some big waveboards be useful for this purpose? I guess they are designed in another way, for big guys and planning conditions in F5.
AHD has made special waveboards for wavesailing like the Seal and sealion, but is not exactly the same concept.
I don't think you'll ever get a wide board to turn that well in waves without a lot of rocker like a SUP.
Even adding a CM or two to a waveboard can make a huge difference and you are talking about going from 62cm to +72cm to get to SUP width.
The reason SUPs don't have footstraps is that you need to be able to move your feet all over the place to get them turning. Using different parts of the rocker to speed up vs turn.
Guys talk about using the new big Kode in waves but I haven't seen any video. Maybe it's roughly like my Kombat which takes moving the rear foot all over to turn on a wave?
Select to expand quoteMucel said..
Do you know if a mix board among waveboard and sup surf has existed? This is, a wide board with mast track and footstraps, capable of planning and getting upwind with a very flat deck? Maybe you could use only the front strap for surfing and move your back foot to the leeward rail to make the wide tail turn tighter.
Ahd will shortly release a new small/hybrid sealion with straps. Around 95l and 70cm wide. Check their YouTube channel, there must be a video of bruno andre talking about it.
Personally I would be curious to test a proper 100l wave board in side off...
Select to expand quoteMucel said..
Do you know if a mix board among waveboard and sup surf has existed? This is, a wide board with mast track and footstraps, capable of planning and getting upwind with a very flat deck? Maybe you could use only the front strap for surfing and move your back foot to the leeward rail to make the wide tail turn tighter.
smik mongrel.
I have a friend that loves his Exocet Kona 9 footer. More of a longboard shape but that means you can sink the tail on the wave and get it to turn pretty good. Why not a wide narrow tailed board like the Quatro Power 115l 67cm wide no rocker but the tail really narrows down.
Anyone try one?
I've just got a Smik Spitfire Custom crossover board for Supping & down the line wavesailing. I've only supped it a few times and it felt unreal. Had a couple of sail runs in 10 knots on flat water just to feel it out and cannot wait to get it out for some light wind wavesailing.
Unfortunately I compressed a disc in my back a few days ago so am out of action. Will keep you posted
Select to expand quoteCalbak said..
I've just got a Smik Spitfire Custom crossover board for Supping & down the line wavesailing. I've only supped it a few times and it felt unreal. Had a couple of sail runs in 10 knots on flat water just to feel it out and cannot wait to get it out for some light wind wavesailing.
Unfortunately I compressed a disc in my back a few days ago so am out of action. Will keep you posted
Hi Calback
Did you recover your back well? I hope so. Any feedback about wavesailing with the spitfire?
Thanks.
I teamed up with Peter Ross to build a one board travel quiver. Windfoil, windsurf, SUP, SUP foil and Wingfoil. Plenty of tail rocker for the SUP and windsurf side of things.
We have been in lockdown since I picked it up. Hopefully get to test it out soon.
For those with OCD sorry about the sideways photos. I couldn't get them sitting straight.
PKenny,
That looks pretty brilliant, can you take a picture of the footstrap positions?
I'm definitely curious about how it wavesails and windfoils.
Select to expand quoteMucel said..
Does somebody know why I feel on going down the wave very slowly with supsurfing board compared with a regular waveboard? Would it be because of the increased width, the small size of the fins of the sup (5" trifin) for the sail, or the rocker?
The volume of the SUP is 105 litres, only a bit bigger than my light wind board.
It's the rocker. Most SUP's have non-planing rocker lines. A windsurf board will always, should always have a planing rocker line. I have a blast wave-sailing both in light winds but prefer the speed of a windsurfer once on a wave.
I have tried to SUP wavesail a Fanatic Prowave but the rocker and small fins don't work very well with a rig in terms of planing, getting up wind and riding waves. I now have a Sunova Acid which has a mini mast rack but don't bother trying to sail it. I used to have a 9' and 10'6 Kona which is a longboard style of waveboard. They were really fun as could get out in light winds and they they would get on the plane with the step hull design. I did find that trying to hit the lip on a 10'6 waveboard was a bit daunting with all the board in front! I recently scored a 110L Carbon Art waveboard and it is awesome for float'n'ride conditions.
You have to use the rails and glide off plane to wavewindSUP. Trying to plane and ride the fin you'll definitely end up downwind plus if there is enough wind for that you can easily be on a waveboard.
I have a 10'6" x 31" Fanatic Fly (160 litres) which has worked great on days when the wind got light but there were still waves. Lots of fun with a 5.8 on it. I am looking at maybe getting a Fanatic Stylemaster (10' x 28" 130 litres) which should still be plenty floaty for me but easier to turn on our mushy Great Lakes waves.
Anyone had any experience with that board?
Drew
Select to expand quoteMark _australia said..
The problem with surf SUP is the sail is exactly in the wrong place for front foot placement - so people tend to do it for a while and give up.
A big waveboard is definitely the go.
Hi
I recover this post, because I've checked what Mark Australia said about position of sail in sups, and it's true. The only SUPboard reported as good at wavesailing is the sealion, which is the only one in which the mast base begins at 125 cm from the tail, as in wavesailing boards. I think this is not by chance. If you put the weight of the rig more forward, more surface of the hull of the board will be in contact with water so the speed going down the wave will be smaller. I'm sure I'm not discovering anything to many people, but it encourages me to try to put a mast base track in the right position on a sup. Any experience of this is appreciated.
The rocker of the supsurfing boards makes them impossible to get planning but it does not make them slow on the wave on supsurfing with paddle. In spite of this, I must admit the increased width and small fins could also reduce the speed.
Cheers
