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Forums > Sailing General

Interesting boats for sale

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Created by theselkie > 9 months ago, 21 Nov 2018
Yara
NSW, 1289 posts
20 Aug 2020 9:31AM
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Select to expand quote
r13 said..
Yes Dudley Dix used what he termed radiused chine in 1994 as per here - 20 years after Van de Stadt.

www.dixdesign.com/radply.htm

Now even most of the frozen snot yachts are using chines..........


The Bluebird 22 ply design from the 1950s is an excellent sea-boat, and translated well into fibreglass. Was once called the "Holden of the Harbour" in the days when people were happy with 22ft.

saltiest1
NSW, 2509 posts
20 Aug 2020 3:47PM
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If I had the coin and storage Id jump on that. It's local too! Most fun I've had on water is on Nacra cats.

Bundeenabuoy
NSW, 1239 posts
21 Aug 2020 4:02AM
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This shows how prices are moving.

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/van-de-stadt-maestro-31/249074

Bundeenabuoy
NSW, 1239 posts
21 Aug 2020 4:16AM
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Ramona said..
It's finally gone!

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/sparkman-stephens-39/230425

Lovely boat and I wish the new owner well.


Not exactly.
My understanding is, its under contract for $43,000 to be picked up when the Victorian Lockdown is lifted.
It could be years before the sale is settled, if it does.

thren
2 posts
21 Aug 2020 8:23AM
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yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/swanson-36/250969
Im tempted to fly up and look at this.....thoughts?
Rigging needs replacing. new motor with 231 hours

Yara
NSW, 1289 posts
21 Aug 2020 10:33AM
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Initial list price does not mean much IMHO. However, looks like it was a "company" boat, so that is a good sign.

BTW Tell us how your Swanson with extra large sails performs. Was reading an article of how a big increase in sail area transformed a UK Colvic-Watson motor-sailer.

r13
NSW, 1587 posts
21 Aug 2020 1:01PM
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One of Laurie Davidson's 1974 designs - reminds a bit of the Miller Matika II

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/davidson-32-davidson-32ft-sloop-built-1974-in-nz/250982

cisco
QLD, 12348 posts
21 Aug 2020 9:13PM
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Select to expand quote
r13 said..
One of Laurie Davidson's 1974 designs - reminds a bit of the Miller Matika II

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/davidson-32-davidson-32ft-sloop-built-1974-in-nz/250982


If she will stand a rigorus survey I think it is a bit of a nick at $29,000.

john24
84 posts
21 Aug 2020 11:00PM
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Select to expand quote
r13 said..
One of Laurie Davidson's 1974 designs - reminds a bit of the Miller Matika II

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/davidson-32-davidson-32ft-sloop-built-1974-in-nz/250982


How are those 4 layers of Kauri held together? Would 1974 predate the common use of epoxy cold moulding?
Looks nice if it is sound.

Ramona
NSW, 7646 posts
22 Aug 2020 8:16AM
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Select to expand quote
cisco said..

r13 said..
One of Laurie Davidson's 1974 designs - reminds a bit of the Miller Matika II

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/davidson-32-davidson-32ft-sloop-built-1974-in-nz/250982



If she will stand a rigorus survey I think it is a bit of a nick at $29,000.


That's a massive drop in price to when she came on the market first.

Ramona
NSW, 7646 posts
22 Aug 2020 8:26AM
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Select to expand quote
john24 said..

r13 said..
One of Laurie Davidson's 1974 designs - reminds a bit of the Miller Matika II

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/davidson-32-davidson-32ft-sloop-built-1974-in-nz/250982



How are those 4 layers of Kauri held together? Would 1974 predate the common use of epoxy cold moulding?
Looks nice if it is sound.


The first boat I built was a Moth sailing dinghy in 1969. I used Urea-formaldehyde glue because it was reasonably priced. There were plenty of epoxy glues I could have used but unlike now these were fairly expensive. Boat builders buying resins in 44 gallon drums though would have been a different story.

r13
NSW, 1587 posts
22 Aug 2020 9:37AM
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Yes probably used a Resorcinol glue as assume Ramona was referring to. Good TDS here and summary article.

www.nightingalesupply.com.au/PDF/Tech_data_adhesves/R15%20RESIN-GRASP%20RP51H%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20Orica%20.pdf

www.christinedemerchant.com/adhesive-glue-resorcinol.html

Ramona
NSW, 7646 posts
22 Aug 2020 6:54PM
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Urea was the yellow stuff, Resorcinal was the deep red coloured stuff you see in plywood.

LooseChange
NSW, 2140 posts
22 Aug 2020 8:02PM
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Ramona said..




Urea was the yellow stuff, Resorcinal was the deep red coloured stuff you see in plywood.


Ramona the melamine urea formaldehyde resin you probably used was manufactured by Selleys and sold as high stress wood glue 308. It was the glue to use if you wanted nearly invisible glue lines. Selleys stopped distributing it on the 29th September 2016 possibly due to it being classed as a hazardous substance by Safe Work Australia.

r13
NSW, 1587 posts
22 Aug 2020 9:53PM
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OK, good one, forgot about the 308. See details below. An excellent wood glue along with Resorcinol, both were used extensively in the 70s and 80s..........would like to do a study on why 308 was classed as hazardous substance but not epoxy with its well known side effects...............but won't go there............308 was not for permanently immersed boats - only for off the beach craft and masts.

www.msdsdigital.com/high-stress-wood-glue-308-kit-discontinued-29-september-2016-msds

Ramona
NSW, 7646 posts
23 Aug 2020 8:42AM
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Select to expand quote
LooseChange said..

Ramona said..






Urea was the yellow stuff, Resorcinal was the deep red coloured stuff you see in plywood.



Ramona the melamine urea formaldehyde resin you probably used was manufactured by Selleys and sold as high stress wood glue 308. It was the glue to use if you wanted nearly invisible glue lines. Selleys stopped distributing it on the 29th September 2016 possibly due to it being classed as a hazardous substance by Safe Work Australia.


I could not afford the 308 glue. It came in a nice box with pictures of yachts on it. Mine came in a brown paper bag, just a yellow powder to which I added the hardener. It did have invisible glue lines because the joints had to be perfect. Not like epoxy where glue lines 2 or 3 mm wide are possible.

Ramona
NSW, 7646 posts
23 Aug 2020 8:46AM
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Thinking back on it the 308 glue was probably not a Selley's product in the 1960's. More like Epicraft or one of those brands that folded.

MorningBird
NSW, 2674 posts
23 Aug 2020 10:08AM
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Select to expand quote
Bundeenabuoy said..

Ramona said..
It's finally gone!

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/sparkman-stephens-39/230425

Lovely boat and I wish the new owner well.



Not exactly.
My understanding is, its under contract for $43,000 to be picked up when the Victorian Lockdown is lifted.
It could be years before the sale is settled, if it does.


A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.

Bundeenabuoy
NSW, 1239 posts
23 Aug 2020 12:37PM
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Select to expand quote
MorningBird said..

Bundeenabuoy said..


Ramona said..
It's finally gone!

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/sparkman-stephens-39/230425

Lovely boat and I wish the new owner well.




Not exactly.
My understanding is, its under contract for $43,000 to be picked up when the Victorian Lockdown is lifted.
It could be years before the sale is settled, if it does.



A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.


Good to see you back.

Andrew68
VIC, 430 posts
23 Aug 2020 5:58PM
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MorningBird said..


A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.


That's what everyone said about my boat, but in-fact took at least another $50K to get it to a point where I was happy to take it into Bass Strait !

I think that S&S39 is great value for money, but to take it into blue water like the great yacht MorningBrid, its going to need new sails, life raft, electronics, autopilot, running rigging, standing rigging, through hulls replaced, safety gear, bilge pumps, plumbing, dingy, batteries etc. I am sure there will be more once it is out of the water it's taken for a shake down sail. It looks like it has been sitting doing nothing for quite a while.

A

lydia
1837 posts
23 Aug 2020 6:47PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Andrew68 said..



MorningBird said..



A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.



That's what everyone said about my boat, but in-fact took at least another $50K to get it to a point where I was happy to take it into Bass Strait !

I think that S&S39 is great value for money, but to take it into blue water like the great yacht MorningBrid, its going to need new sails, life raft, electronics, autopilot, running rigging, standing rigging, through hulls replaced, safety gear, bilge pumps, plumbing, dingy, batteries etc. I am sure there will be more once it is out of the water it's taken for a shake down sail. It looks like it has been sitting doing nothing for quite a while.

A


Like he said.
It is not the sticker price that is the problem.
Looking at the ad, take another $75k

Bundeenabuoy
NSW, 1239 posts
24 Aug 2020 5:45AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Andrew68 said..







MorningBird said..





A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.





That's what everyone said about my boat, but in-fact took at least another $50K to get it to a point where I was happy to take it into Bass Strait !

I think that S&S39 is great value for money, but to take it into blue water like the great yacht MorningBrid, its going to need new sails, life raft, electronics, autopilot, running rigging, standing rigging, through hulls replaced, safety gear, bilge pumps, plumbing, dingy, batteries etc. I am sure there will be more once it is out of the water it's taken for a shake down sail. It looks like it has been sitting doing nothing for quite a while.

A




If you have unlimited time, and money is not an issue then this is a great project.
We all have different criteria with variable skill sets. What is an enjoyable challenge for one can be a never ending nightmare for another.
Andrew's phrase 'where I was happy with it' resonates with me.
My other consideration is 'what will I be able to sell it for' if I need to sell it in a reasonable time frame.
Some owners 'selling' price their boats by the time and money they have put in and occasionally this is a successful process if the result is special. Some of us will pay 'over the odds' to own it.
In my experience unfortunately this does not happen very often but it is all fun and games and how lucky we are to play.

Andrew68
VIC, 430 posts
25 Aug 2020 11:46AM
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Select to expand quote
Bundeenabuoy said..


Andrew68 said..





MorningBird said..



A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.




If you have unlimited time, and money is not an issue then this is a great project.
We all have different criteria with variable skill sets. What is an enjoyable challenge for one can be a never ending nightmare for another.
Andrew's phrase 'where I was happy with it' resonates with me.



OK, I must admit I am new to sailing, but what I have found is that almost anything metal on a boat has a serviceable life of 20 years, or less.

The sailors I know that are doing offshore work are undertaking complete re-fits on a 10-15 year cycle and this is consistent with boats that are for sale that are being used off shore. I know about 10 people who have lost their rigs and I have seen first hand lots of examples of near misses - all on old kit that would have catastrophic. I have seen out of date life rafts fail, VHF radio's with less than a 5-mile reception, anchor fittings, fuel fittings, auto-pilot, bilge pumps fail. I have been the only yacht out of a half a dozen that has a floating dinghy with a working outboard motor.

If I was fair weather club sailing in the bay, sure no problem, but 100 miles off land in 40 knots it is a different story. Then you also need to consider the liability risk if you are taking on crew.

I think the costs depend on what point in the re-fit life cycle the boat is and whether you are prepared to run to failure or have a reasonable margin of safety. I am an engineer, qualified electrician, do all my carpentry, fibre glassing, engine servicing, assist my rigger, climb the mast, search the web on ebay, gum tree for cheap parts and I still couldn't get the costs down. All the small costs add up. Despite all the work, the boat still looks the same as when I bought it, I have pretty low standards, I just want to be happy that the boat floats, rig wont come down, the keel won't come off, I can call for help and I wont be sued. I enjoy the challenge and love the boat, but for most that want a similar level of safety to what they would expect for their family or work, it is expensive BOAT business.

There is definitely a group of sailors that are oblivious to safety risk. Here are some photos from my boat that previous owners and others have taken into bass strait. None of this was immediately visible and was not picked up even in survey. This sort of stuff seems common, at least in Victoria, in older boats and I think should be expected over a 20 year life cycle.





50% of the deck fittings were like this. All between 15-20years old:



crack in fore stay turnbuckle (under furler):

don't worry, you can polish out those rust stains...someone actually said this to me about this stanchion before it cracked.


lydia
1837 posts
25 Aug 2020 2:25PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Andrew68 said..

Bundeenabuoy said..



Andrew68 said..







MorningBird said..




A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.





If you have unlimited time, and money is not an issue then this is a great project.
We all have different criteria with variable skill sets. What is an enjoyable challenge for one can be a never ending nightmare for another.
Andrew's phrase 'where I was happy with it' resonates with me.




OK, I must admit I am new to sailing, but what I have found is that almost anything metal on a boat has a serviceable life of 20 years, or less.

The sailors I know that are doing offshore work are undertaking complete re-fits on a 10-15 year cycle and this is consistent with boats that are for sale that are being used off shore. I know about 10 people who have lost their rigs and I have seen first hand lots of examples of near misses - all on old kit that would have catastrophic. I have seen out of date life rafts fail, VHF radio's with less than a 5-mile reception, anchor fittings, fuel fittings, auto-pilot, bilge pumps fail. I have been the only yacht out of a half a dozen that has a floating dinghy with a working outboard motor.

If I was fair weather club sailing in the bay, sure no problem, but 100 miles off land in 40 knots it is a different story. Then you also need to consider the liability risk if you are taking on crew.

I think the costs depend on what point in the re-fit life cycle the boat is and whether you are prepared to run to failure or have a reasonable margin of safety. I am an engineer, qualified electrician, do all my carpentry, fibre glassing, engine servicing, assist my rigger, climb the mast, search the web on ebay, gum tree for cheap parts and I still couldn't get the costs down. All the small costs add up. Despite all the work, the boat still looks the same as when I bought it, I have pretty low standards, I just want to be happy that the boat floats, rig wont come down, the keel won't come off, I can call for help and I wont be sued. I enjoy the challenge and love the boat, but for most that want a similar level of safety to what they would expect for their family or work, it is expensive BOAT business.

There is definitely a group of sailors that are oblivious to safety risk. Here are some photos from my boat that previous owners and others have taken into bass strait. None of this was immediately visible and was not picked up even in survey. This sort of stuff seems common, at least in Victoria, in older boats and I think should be expected over a 20 year life cycle.





50% of the deck fittings were like this. All between 15-20years old:



crack in fore stay turnbuckle (under furler):

don't worry, you can polish out those rust stains...someone actually said this to me about this stanchion before it cracked.



Like Andy says, on Defiance, the only metal not replaced has been the rudder shaft, keel bolts (previously done), stanchions (not original) and chainplates which were removed and resealed.
even the shaft tube was replaced with a GRP tube.
But the aim was to make it seaworthy.

r13
NSW, 1587 posts
25 Aug 2020 6:36PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Andrew68 said..

Bundeenabuoy said..



Andrew68 said..







MorningBird said..




A week of cleaning and polishing and $10,000 on electrics and rigging and it is a great buy. Maybe another $10,000 on standing rigging but still a great yacht for the money.
That is the same price I sold Morning Bird for, $42,500.





If you have unlimited time, and money is not an issue then this is a great project.
We all have different criteria with variable skill sets. What is an enjoyable challenge for one can be a never ending nightmare for another.
Andrew's phrase 'where I was happy with it' resonates with me.




OK, I must admit I am new to sailing, but what I have found is that almost anything metal on a boat has a serviceable life of 20 years, or less.

The sailors I know that are doing offshore work are undertaking complete re-fits on a 10-15 year cycle and this is consistent with boats that are for sale that are being used off shore. I know about 10 people who have lost their rigs and I have seen first hand lots of examples of near misses - all on old kit that would have catastrophic. I have seen out of date life rafts fail, VHF radio's with less than a 5-mile reception, anchor fittings, fuel fittings, auto-pilot, bilge pumps fail. I have been the only yacht out of a half a dozen that has a floating dinghy with a working outboard motor.

If I was fair weather club sailing in the bay, sure no problem, but 100 miles off land in 40 knots it is a different story. Then you also need to consider the liability risk if you are taking on crew.

I think the costs depend on what point in the re-fit life cycle the boat is and whether you are prepared to run to failure or have a reasonable margin of safety. I am an engineer, qualified electrician, do all my carpentry, fibre glassing, engine servicing, assist my rigger, climb the mast, search the web on ebay, gum tree for cheap parts and I still couldn't get the costs down. All the small costs add up. Despite all the work, the boat still looks the same as when I bought it, I have pretty low standards, I just want to be happy that the boat floats, rig wont come down, the keel won't come off, I can call for help and I wont be sued. I enjoy the challenge and love the boat, but for most that want a similar level of safety to what they would expect for their family or work, it is expensive BOAT business.

There is definitely a group of sailors that are oblivious to safety risk. Here are some photos from my boat that previous owners and others have taken into bass strait. None of this was immediately visible and was not picked up even in survey. This sort of stuff seems common, at least in Victoria, in older boats and I think should be expected over a 20 year life cycle.





50% of the deck fittings were like this. All between 15-20years old:



crack in fore stay turnbuckle (under furler):

don't worry, you can polish out those rust stains...someone actually said this to me about this stanchion before it cracked.



The best post I have ever read on this or any forum, great thanks, trust all on the forum read it and take it on board for their next preventive (or preventative whichever you prefer) maintenance to-do list.

Kinora
VIC, 180 posts
25 Aug 2020 7:04PM
Thumbs Up

Having just started my own journey with a 1977 Currawong, I can only second r13's comments and commend Andrew68's post to all those contemplating buying their first boat.

Thanks, Andrew68!

lydia
1837 posts
25 Aug 2020 5:51PM
Thumbs Up

By messenger, I have been chatting to a few people about the current focus of the thread as to buying boats cheaply and the costs of truly making them reliable for offshore passages.
Here are some unflattering pics of Defiance on the way through.
So be brave and jump in and get the big issues early.


Engine bay with engine removed for replacement and cleaning


The last one was a very small weep under a skin fitting that required a huge repair of three layers of Oregon planking

all the expensive work was fixing modifications made after launch that had not been done properly.


Deck repair because of a poorly installed anchor locker.



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"Interesting boats for sale" started by theselkie